Does pop bonus affect maximum population, or resident space?

Natso

Does pop bonus affect maximum population, or resident space? There is a big difference there. If pop bonus affects residence space, then a res can house, potentially, more than 70/75 military. If pop bonus only affects maximum population, then a res can house either 84/90 population or 70/75 military.

Mal

Most pk calcs make it modify residence space. I think it's more likely that it's maximum population though. It's actually not that big of a difference in pks because pks focus on pop loss and not max pop, and errors resulting from residence space calculations are usually inclusive of any overkill done or other errors.

Mal

I think a good indicator is that FW got nerfed to 5% pop bonus. Of course there's two ways to look at that but I think it means that if FW stayed at it's current level then barracks would be worthless.

Natso

Well, if the norm is 50 to 66 (+16) and FW's norm (is it +20% for FW?) is 60 to 79 (+19, 13 over), the new norm is 70 to 90 (+20) and FW's norm is 73.5 to 94.5 (+21, 4.5 over). FW was nerfed because 84 to 108 (+24, 18 over) would have been too extreme. Though, I think the nerf was pretty extreme too.

cishome

Why do I get the feeling bcart is vague on purpose regarding this issue? I think he likes to watch us squirm and argue

Tyrsis

No he just doesn't care as should you.

cishome

If I didn't care I wouldn't play. What's the point of playing something you have absolutely no interest in?

Tyrsis

Once you stop caring you can actually enjoy the game instead of being caught up in the same bullshit round after round. Besides someone else will actually do the math and then I can just adjust my KD from there.

cishome

I'm not sure I understand what you mean :P but I like the math part of the game (as well as hitting retards ofc). I don't care the least about the politics part, though I sometimes find it amusing to see what happens

Tyrsis

You have no idea how easy it is to irritate some of the players in this game. All it takes is a little antagonizing and they flip out. Who cares about winning or losing when you have a 24/7 entertainment reel just by pushing a few buttons on certain players?

cishome

Yes about this I agree :P especially fun that I see some names in game now that I hit last round and they.. well, reacted in a way that makes me want to smack them again this round, so to speak Will be a blast

Natso

Assuming that pop bonus only affects pop maximum, here's how it goes:

Normal PT: Obtain Fusion, ditch SMs
DW: Obtain Longevity, ditch SMs
VI: SMs are your whores, keep them

Results based on Income:Land when you consider the cost of power of a full Res vs a SM as a quantity of land.

Hyrule

I'm fairly sure its the base. He even worded it that way. Otherwise wouldn't he have just said every pt will have +40% pop. Which is still the same as making res hold 70. The only difference is when/how other bonuses/disadvantages are applied.

I do understand your question as its very different depending....

50*1.6 = 80
70*1.2= 98


Anyway we won't know for sure until the round starts and you can divide your pop by your res. My gut tells me its the second equation and populations will be huge.

I was under the impression that all bonuses directly affected the res space and not the overall pop. Meaning, that yes with enough bonuses res > rax.

The big question is WTF does longevity do? I could totally see longevity nerfing your round bonus.

I'm fairly sure its the base. He even worded it that way. Otherwise wouldn't he have just said every pt will have +40% pop. Which is still the same as making res hold 70. The only difference is when/how other bonuses/disadvantages are applied.

I do understand your question as its very different depending....

50*1.6 = 80
70*1.2= 98


Anyway we won't know for sure until the round starts and you can divide your pop by your res. My gut tells me its the second equation and populations will be huge.

I was under the impression that all bonuses directly affected the res space and not the overall pop. Meaning, that yes with enough bonuses res > rax.

The big question is WTF does longevity do? I could totally see longevity nerfing your round bonus.

Natso

That's not the issue, Hyrule. He specifically raised the capacity of the Res from 50 to 70. And longevity is a potential hazard, but a different one than I'm talking about here.

I don't think anyone doubts that a full Res without longevity and with 20% pop bonus will contain 84 pop. What matters is whether a Res full of military, without longevity and with 20% pop bonus will contain 84 military, or just 70.

cishome

This is most certainly not a reliable source, but I'm just saying:

From the help section on SK

"Population Bonus By increasing the capacity of the Residence building, a kingdom can increase the population above normal.

Maximum 20%
Increases Population "

The capacity of a residence building is to me crystal clear that that would include military also. The thought behind military being in res is them taking the spots from the civilians, why would then these two be different values?

Hyrule

I was under the impression that all bonuses directly affected the res space and not the overall pop. Meaning, that yes with enough bonuses res > rax.

Maybe that wasn't clear or got lost in the post. But I've always thought it was that way. For instance when FW was 20% I thought we had all agreed that your res held more than rax but was a very marginal difference at 77 vs 75.

Mal

I don't think anyone did experiements on this because it's not very important usually to pks as i posted earlier. I think it's more likely that pop bonus affects max population also because it's in tune with bcart's established trend of adding bases up first and then modifying with a total amount of percentage bonuses later. (longevity is a bit different changing the base value). So in that case the res would only contain the 70 military. We'll find out easily within the first week of the round though.

Hyrule

We'll find out easily within the first week of the round though.

Agreed.

Mal

This is most certainly not a reliable source, but I'm just saying:

From the help section on SK

"Population Bonus By increasing the capacity of the Residence building, a kingdom can increase the population above normal.

Maximum 20%
Increases Population "

The capacity of a residence building is to me crystal clear that that would include military also. The thought behind military being in res is them taking the spots from the civilians, why would then these two be different values?

Good point. But the explanation could be literary in nature and not related to the formula. Bcart has done that before to.

Persona

I'm not sure why anyone would go all residences in any case, as a single person could likely PK you with kidnaps alone.

Hyrule

I'm not sure why anyone would go all residences in any case, as a single person could likely PK you with kidnaps alone.

Same reason people go r/r and die to server crashes...

Mal

actually kidnaps aren't affected. An all res kd could be put into overflow from arsons alone though.

Persona

That's what I meant. And arsons would be huge since you would have lots of res.

Hyrule

actually kidnaps aren't affected. An all res kd could be put into overflow from arsons alone though.

This. Correct me if I'm wrong. But arsons are related more to the amount of probes so does that really change anything?